Mixed Grain/Legume/Seed Sourdough Culture Symbiosis

Greetings everyone! This will be my second post in here. It is a follow up to the original train-of-thought introduction that i made. I wanted to share some more updates. I never heard back with any response from anyone, on the first one, but i have been continuing this experiment, and i enjoy it and feel that it is working very nicely. Good success so far. (If you would go back and read my first post, then you will get a bit of a background of this mixed-flour culture.)

https://weightloss-slim.fit/node/66846/mixed-sourdough-starter-w-legumes-and-flax-symbiosis%3C/a%3E%3C/p%3E%3Cp%3EIn short, i have been making a sourdough starter culture symbiosis of mixed grain, legumes, and seeds. Since my last post, i stopped using the separate, smaller 'starter' mason jar, and i switched to using a medium-sized glass bowl with a small, ceramic plate on top, with a little spacer inserted on one side to allow some oxygen flow. I feed it, once a day or so, flours of corn, wheat, flaxseed, and some legumes. In this case, i am still some-what "compensating" with a not-so-ideal 'Great Northern Bean'. This is because i have that available, and it works alright. In the past, i used chickpeas, which i think are the ideal. Also, i used little, red lentils, which worked really good. Even more recently, i tried black eyed peas, and the aroma on that was really, really good. Something to take note of even. So, the 'Great Northern Beans' were like the closest thing that i had available to the black eyed peas. (It takes a little time for the probiotic enzymes to get into a healthy digestion, when one changes the ingredient.) Anyways, i make a symbiotic mix of all of these ingredients, and it is most certainly a happy little symphony and they get along quite nice. There is levitation within a few hours and a very nice smell. I stopped adding any extra addition of the very-little sugar, that i used as a jump-start and as a PH modification. (That did make it kind of like the end-product bread had almost like a balsamic vinegar taste to it though....which was very good in its own right, but....) ...It is not necessary because it is so active and digests very well. Also, i am letting it thoroughly ferment, and i want to get kind of more-so like a "cheese-like" attribute, and so i am allowing it to sit around for many hours. In that case, the sugars could make it too sour, because even without, it can become quite a tangy bread. (I like the vitamins and minerals.)

Here is an important topic to this whole thing: What i am doing is i build up my culture in the bowl for various days. Maybe 3 max, but i could go longer. I just let it build up, until i finally take out a spoonful of the wet dough, so that i may use it for the new round of starter, and then i add in all of my salt and spices and herbs and ultimate flour. But this gives the quality of a very well aged culture, being as i am using such a large quantity of a slowly fermented culture. I do not see any signs of it being unhealthy, so long as i am feeding it in time. I don't know how long i can build up a culture like this. (Can one do this indefinitely, so long as one keeps up the regular feeding???) I have been experimenting in making a wetter dough, so that it expands well. I have been "kneading" it with a spoon in the bowl, as of lately, and then lightly kneading it on a board with light flour on it, and then making a bread that is like 1 1/2 - 2" tall or so. I also tried to just pour out a even wetter batter into a bread pan that was oiled and buttered (Like the Danish Rye Bread [Rugbrød] ). This made a fluffier dough, but i actually really like the first-mentioned version. I don't know which one is "better"... Both are different. But i like to make wedges, and i kind of like a denser bread that i can spread on butter or use to dip with.

The bread is getting a really good flavor. I need to change up the legume ingredient for optimal effect and flavor, though. I mentioned in the first post how the Greeks used to make a sourdough bread that was made out of Chickpeas named Eftazimo. https://www.thehungrybites.com/chickpea-starter-cretan-traditional-bread-eftazimo/

I also read about how the Greeks used 'vetch' as the fermentation catalyst. Here is the link to one man's practice: https://tavolamediterranea.com/2020/08/30/pliny-elder-chickling-vetch-sourdough-bread-starter/

(There is some silly, comedic element in there, but....Thanks for the info!) So, i am not following these things exactly, but i feel like i making something that is some-what related to those things. I read about this after i was already doing some experiments.

Thankyou for reading. I hope that you enjoyed reading this. In short, i am sharing my experiences with you, and i am wanting to let you know that i believe that having a well-balanced culture is very good. It is a holistic balance. Definitely it is not the same as a standard culture, and it could not replace it. It is a different thing, but i like it very much. I am curious as to what anyone thinks, and if many have been doing this sort of thing in here.....If you have any experience with these things, let me know what you think.

PS // I am getting a great effect by putting 3 layers of well-moist paper towels on top of my bread, and then wrapping it in a thin towel (bottom and top wrap-around), and then putting it in the oven on the lowest heat setting, which is 170 degrees. I turn the heat off once it hits the temp, and i just let it sit in there. In the sun, it works too, but i like to give it a boost in the cold morning, when i have the time and option. It works, too, without the extra heat, but i have seen and heard lots of activity with the additional heat, and it rises much more quickly. I noticed that the Eftazimo recipe mentions using a rising temperature of about 86°F – 104°F (30°C – 40°C). Obviously in bulk baking one would use a mister or something....i am imagining.....but this is working great for my personal use.

Hope you enjoy reading. Thank you.

do you have any pictures you can share of the batter fermenting and of the baked bread?

Hey. I am happy to hear of your interest in the experiment. I do not have any photos available right now, but i do have a friend who has a smart-phone that i think she would allow me to use so that i could upload it. I will ask her when i see her later today. If so, i could probably get an image later today or by tomorrow. (I was thinking about how i should probably have a picture earlier.....) I have one rising right now, and it is a free-standing wetter dough. I am experimenting with just mixing it up in the bowl and getting it to a thick, but sticky and wet consistency. I did not want to dry it up so much, because i want to see how well the organisms can spread through the moisture and how much expansion i can get. I dropped it onto an oiled, flat pan and shaped it up my using the round and smooth side of the spoon. (I have never done that before...) This was the first loaf that i incorporated a bit of milk and oil into, so it ended up being somewhat lubricated, i think.... It is an additional experiment. I will have to see how that rises and what smell/flavors come from it.

Thank for the response and your interest. I will work on a photo. I have 3/4th of a standard loaf that i have been making, too, that was made free-standing, though more-so kneaded and shaped by hand. It is a denser bread, but it turned out to be a really good taste and nutritive factor on that one. Maybe i can compare them.

Cheers

Please excuse me. I know that i said that i was going to get some photos uploaded......For some reason i am having a hard time with the photo software for my friend's camera. I have many pictures ready for upload, but i am struggling with getting the right updates for this old Windows OS. Anyhow, it turns out that the wetter dough with the milk and oil worked out great. It is really taking on a very good characteristic. I have even began adding a bit of sugar in there again too. This kind of bread is really different smelling than a typical bread, from what i can tell. It smells like there is a full on meal or something in the oven. Probably due to all of the amino acid combinations or something. Anyhow, still, when i get the ability to upload some photos, somehow, i will post them. Please be a bit patient with me.....

Thanks for taking an interest